Did anyone catch Shoji on Bobby’s show this morning?

December 4th, 2012

All-American teams should be announced later today. I won’t be able to monitor. having oral surgery that will last all morning.  will get to it when I get back home.

Dang, only caught Shoji’s  last comment, something about exploring other avenues to get seeded.

At least that’s what I thought he said.

Agree that it is tiresome that the complaints about seeding continue. It’s pau and it is what it was. However think we pretty much all agree that Hawaii seems to be the only school that consistently gets the short end by the selection committee.

Someone said that the answer was to win all their matches. There is no undefeated team in the country this season. Obviously it didn’t hurt to lose in the other conferences. It wasn’t Hawaii’s fault that the Big West had a down year.

The RPI is a computer ranking but it is not infallible. Someone had to input the info and you have to wonder how the original data was weighted.

People keep talking about next year’s schedule and the RPI. Next year’s RPI has noting to do with this year’s RPI. It’s a different season. And San Diego State coming over to the big west will only help if Deitre’s schedule is good and the Aztecs win. Even being the MWC co-champ this year didn’t give SDSU a seed. Feel that whatever strength SDSU brings will be negated by Boise State also being in the league.


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  • Jesse December 4, 2012 at 7:01 am

    Hope someone can recap the show.
    All region teams out, congrats to emily and mita but jane and jade got screwed! How is it the best middle in the big west doesnt make it but the cal state northridge middle does? Again think formico making region foy over vorster is a joke, digging stats are over rated.

    • roy December 4, 2012 at 8:29 am

      Regional Freshman of the Year must be a true freshman, not a redshirt freshman. Conference rules can allow for a redshirt freshman to win, but not AVCA awards.

      • Cindy Luis December 4, 2012 at 7:13 pm

        Never heard that. Freshmen and freshmen.

        • roy December 5, 2012 at 9:17 am

          You can find the information on the AVCA website under the Award Nomination section. They have a public packet that has all the criteria. They state that Regional Freshman of the Year candidates must be true freshmen.

          • Cindy Luis December 5, 2012 at 9:49 am

            Thank you. I stand corrected.

  • Robin December 4, 2012 at 7:22 am

    I listened to it. He said he was going to talk to a committee member today to inquiry about the criteria. That he wasn’t going to sphew ‘venom’, just get a better feel for what can be done next year. Wishes if they just didn’t want to fly teams out to Hawaii, that still Hawaii should have be the seeded team, at say, Santa Clara, which he used as an example.

  • Jesse December 4, 2012 at 7:27 am

    Remember when they used to go to a tourney at pacific? I hope they do that again but somewhere else where they can face some top 40 competition, if the wahine dont get seeded after that heads will roll.

    • Cindy Luis December 4, 2012 at 7:15 pm

      They used to go to UOP back in the day because the conference didn’t have a tournament.
      There are not a lot of open dates. They have a limit of playing dates … believe it’s 28. They can double up on matches on a single day, which is why you see teams with over 30 matches going into the post season.
      You’re going to have 20 Big West matches next year. which leaves only 8 playing dates left. wondering with the increase in Big West matches if one of those tournaments will only be two teams.

  • Otto December 4, 2012 at 7:59 am

    He said he has some ideas that he wanted to share with a specific committee member to get them to think outside the box. The example he gave was to make UH the seeded team, but host on the mainland. UH could help the host school in setting things up. He said one of the difficulties is that UH submits a bid for thursday/friday. He thinks the NCAA doesn’t have time to make the arrangements and fly teams to Hawaii in such a short time (i.e., brackets annouced on sunday, need to fly tuesday, winner then needs to fly to regional site). Also the conflict with the marathon makes it hard too. In past years I remember discussion about similar timing issues, UH always has a home football game the first saturday in December, so volleyball playoff needs to be thursday/friday instead of friday/saturday, since UH tries not to schedule home volleyball and football on the same day

    • setaone December 4, 2012 at 8:26 am

      I know that football is the “big dog” but why doesn’t football have a bye week or play away for that Saturday?

      • Warrior-15 December 4, 2012 at 9:36 am

        because it’s usually the last weekend of the regular college football season. they want to end the season at home.

    • WaWa December 4, 2012 at 2:00 pm

      I called it. It’s unfortunate that UH cannot put together an attractive package for the NCAA. It’s tough w/FB.

      • Cindy Luis December 4, 2012 at 7:11 pm

        UH puts in attractive bids. but that is now for the Regionals. has nothing to do with first-second rounds now. it’s about seeding

  • Otto December 4, 2012 at 8:02 am

    He said that UH met all the criteria for a seed, winning last 10 games, no bad losses, etc. So if the NCAA truly won’t consider them to host the opening rounds, then just tell them up front to not submit a bid.

    • Warrior-15 December 4, 2012 at 9:45 am

      there’s more criteria than that. hawaii just didn’t play a lot of teams in the top 25 or 50 of the RPI, which is another criteria looked at for seeding.

      i think it was a fluke in hawaii’s schedule. for instance, last year, when hawaii had a 7 RPI going into the tournament, they had also gone 7-1 against RPI top 50 teams.

      this year, hawaii’s schedule just wasn’t very RPI favorable. they went 1-1 against top 25 RPI teams, and 3-2 against the RPI top 50. if you’re vying for a seed, that’s not giving the committee a whole to go on.

      last year, hawaii had the 3 early season tournaments, plus they played pepperdine (2x) and notre dame (2x). this year, b/c of the increase in nonconference matches in the Big West (18), it limited hawaii’s nonconference scheduling, so they weren’t able to schedule an extra 2-4 nonconference matches that could have really boosted their RPI.

      it’s a scheduling limitation that i hope Shoji figures out a way around. i hope they can remedy it in the future, and also, of course, i hope the Big West raises their game, and their RPI in future years…

      • Cindy Luis December 4, 2012 at 7:08 pm

        They are no longer submitting bids for 1st-2nd rounds. it is based on seeding. All UH tells the NCAA is they are available to host if seeded.

  • HawaiiMongoose December 4, 2012 at 8:08 am

    Robin and Otto summed it up well. Dave wants to do something constructive to try to prevent a repeat next year of what happened this year, i.e. #8 going up against #5 in the second round. Assuming UH does what’s necessary to earn a top 16 seeding, he’s open to an arrangement that would have the Wahine seeded but playing on the west coast instead of hosting at home. He’ll be reaching out to committee members to talk about this and expects to talk to at least one member as early as today.

    • Cindy Luis December 4, 2012 at 7:18 pm

      UH as been seeded and sent to the mainland. It has happened a number of times. they year they went to Long beach comes to mind in 06. and they hosted the regional.
      but things have changed since them now they are going so much on the RPI.

  • wop ur jaws December 4, 2012 at 8:09 am

    And I keep telling you…for a mid term goal, get UH into a BCS conference or a mid major that has relevance. Like the WCC. In time, and quickly, the landscape of Div 1 athletics will be so different as we know it. I predict there will be only a handful of super conferences and virtually no small mid level conferences. Once the BCS starts bringing in more schools, the left overs will be over. Because of the sizes of the super conferences, they will have little wiggle room to play teams outside of its conference. UH may consider getting ahead of the pack instead of joining in. With the stan sherriff, stan wanted a larger venue to compete with the rest of the country and UH said no. If you use that as an analogy, UH must consider going beyond today or it will be obsolete. For the Stan, more and more schools are building bigger venues so more attendance can happen and sooner than later, UH will no longer have the most attendance because they cannot hold as much people at one time. Im telling you, having a progressive rather than conservative vision for UH will be the best investment they can do to stay relevant. It’s a holistic approach not piece meal.

    • wop ur jaws December 4, 2012 at 8:27 am

      So how can UH compete? Holistically you have to start with the education level. Even though UH’s entrance scores are as high as other well known universities, outside of Hawai’i no one knows it. Students think of UH as a party school even though its not. It’s really a commuter school trying to be a university town. Secondly, the infrastructure and buildings have to improve. It’s a good thing to see new buildings on campus, but the rash of crimes and assaults lately does not speak well of the security and the company running it. The faculty is top notch but perhaps in a few departments and not all. Thirdly, get a deep pocket corporation to sponsor the campus. Yes its unholly to purists, however consider the competition. BCS schools not only have very rich and loyal alumni and donors, but they have embraced corporate sponsorship, at least to further athletic programs. Get Hawaiian air or google to sponsor the stan sherrif and call it the Hawaiian Air Stan Sherriff center, I mean its going to be about money anyways. If its done together with guidelines, it can work. And lastly, be more like the people you are trying to play with. Invest in the programs academically and athletically in order to compete. If UH does not want its Athletic programs to bring in more money, interest from the public and notoriety, than keep doing what it is doing otherwise change things.

    • Warrior-15 December 4, 2012 at 9:51 am

      there’s no guarantee the BCS will be around. the college football landscape is also changing. for example, this shift to a 4-team playoff.

      just because it seems like all the big/BCS conferences are sucking teams (and money) in, it doesn’t mean these “superconferences” will bring stability.

      the BCS contracts run out in 2 years (2014, i believe), and there’s no guarantee they will be renewed or renegotiated. if they’re not renewed, then there will most certainly be a whole lot more movement and realignment ahead.

      • wop ur jaws December 4, 2012 at 11:48 am

        that’s the kind response i’m talking about. Look call it what you want, but if you think the BCS SCHOOLS are not going to be around then you may not have the vision for future growth. Don’t kid yourself thinking because the BCS structure will change that they won’t be in control of the NCAA for many years to come. Instead I see it as a needed update to the structure in order to keep school athletics making money. No one I talk to thinks the BCS structure will remain the same… but its short sighted to think that being part of those conferences is the where the future lies. They have the most lucrative TV markets and that is the only way schools can be competitive. Hawai’i will never 8 million in population, but they have a lot of interest from pacific islands and asia as a tv market. And everyone should know that recruiting for football in poly islands and places like new zealand and australia or japan or china for women’s volleyball is already making headways in the NCAA. Think forward-regardless of how the BCS or whatever they will call it’s structure evolves, its more intelligent to be a player in the field than liability.

  • Warriorfan December 4, 2012 at 8:23 am

    Are u kidding Hinger made all region over Vorster? Hinger who hits .240 as a middle????

  • rage777 December 4, 2012 at 8:42 am

    The problem is not the schedule. The problem is the Big West teams (including Hawaii) that lose to other conferences. If the Pac12 schools all lost their out of conference matches, then if one of them went undefeated in the Pac12. It doesn’t really matter that they went undefeated because it looks like their conference is weak. If the Big West was to win all their conference matches, but then the Big West champion lost 3 games in conference it looks like the Big West is very competitive and has a lot of good teams. But the key is to win the out of conference matches, no matter what. Of course if you play all the junk teams from the other conferences, that won’t really help. But if they are beating the Washingtons, Florida States, etc of the conference then it looks pretty good.

  • Bow Alumni December 4, 2012 at 8:46 am

    Submit Las Vegas as our alternate site to host! That’s almost as good a location to get some sort of Home Court advantage.

    • dedicatedfan December 4, 2012 at 9:21 am

      That is an interesting idea you have. I would think Sam Boyd would also back that idea up, by helping out money wise. It will be on a sort of neutral court. We all know how much Hawaii fans love to go to Vegas. Just gives them another reason to go there. If the NCAA, will not allow Hawaii to host in Hawaii, due to money. Then Dave should tell the Selection Committee, ok, seed us, and we will gladly host the 1st and 2nd round in Vegas. Like I said, it will be a neutral court, but with alot, and I do mean alot, of Hawaii fans.

    • rnr December 4, 2012 at 11:23 am

      What a splendid Idea and a alternative plan!!

  • Lowtone123 December 4, 2012 at 9:21 am

    Listened to the interview. Robin & Otto summed it up well. Dave was hoping to speak to the committee member as early as today. Dave had some recommendations to forward in hopes of at least “planting the seed” for future changes. Dave was hoping to get an explanation as well as to why the Wahine wasn’t seeded. In the past the Wahine was “on the fence” and so the committee had some justification for sending the Wahine away but this season the Wahine had met all of the criteria not to mention they we’re ranked 8th while some host teams weren’t even ranked.

  • Nobody December 4, 2012 at 9:26 am

    IMHO, why doesn’t the UH Athletic Dept. maybe send asst AD MM go and find out once and for all. To sit back and grumble every year isn’t doing anyone any good. IMO, there should/must be a basic formula and then, some sort of rating by region, cost, or what ever. Seems like the same schools are always hosting, why is that? Maybe she can see what actually happened to UH this year. Holding the committee accountable is a good thing. Can she get on this committee? There must be others who are not happy with the process. Go as a group if possible. Do something. After all, last year wasn’t UH the only site to actually make money? That’s what I thought I read.

  • Lowtone123 December 4, 2012 at 9:28 am

    Bow Alumni…That is a great idea! It would be as close to a home court advantage for the Wahine without being at the SSC. With the fans here and on the mainland there could be at least 5,000 or more cheering for the Wahine.

    • dedicatedfan December 4, 2012 at 9:44 am

      Could possibly be more. We all know how much Hawaii people love to go to Las Vegas. Just need an excuse to do so, What better excuse is there, then to see the Wahine play in the 1st and 2nd round, of the NCAA Tournament.

  • Judge Judy December 4, 2012 at 9:39 am

    Hosting on the mainland is absolute BS.The NCAA needs to stop discriminating against Hawaii because of their location.

    This is a discrimination case. It needs to be tested in the courts.

    • warriorfan December 4, 2012 at 5:22 pm

      Hosting on the mainland is a terrible idea. Hate it.
      UH hosting only should be at the SSC. one thing I wanna know why did they not send UH to the kentucky sub regional. If UH was the strongest team left out of hosting they should have been sent to the weakest team hosting NOT UW who everyone knows was a top 7 team all season.

    • Kazu December 5, 2012 at 4:00 am

      If Hawaii is going to host it should be here at home. Just think if they host on the mainland what about all the fans that attend the games every week,but can’t afford to make the trip to the mainland.

  • dedicatedfan December 4, 2012 at 9:43 am

    Just to let you all know, I just emailed Dave Shoji, about putting across the idea, to the Selection Committee, of Hawaii hosting the 1st and 2nd round, BUT in Las Vegas. I would think Dave Shoji, and the Athletic Department, could work out some kind of monetary backing from Mr. Sam Boyd, there in Las Vegas, and also, Hawaiian Air.

  • dedicatedfan December 4, 2012 at 9:51 am

    Cindy, when it comes to SDSU, I have no dought that Deitre has her team in an upward trend. So I see SDSU as a VERY BIG PLUS. She wants SDSU to be as good, and dominant, as the Wahine. As for BSU, their volleyball team has been stagnant for years. Do not see any significant change in that trend, so a BIG NEGATIVE.

    • Cindy Luis December 4, 2012 at 7:21 pm

      Didn’t say SDSU was a negative. But it still depends on how SDSU schedules in the preseason and how they do.
      My point was Boise State was a negative and the two of them joining the BWC made it a wash. unless Boise State decides to upgrade their vb problem. Don’t see that happening. Money goes to football.

      • kaleiboy December 4, 2012 at 9:31 pm

        You said in you opening post that SDSC was joining the WAC. You did mean Big West?

        • Cindy Luis December 4, 2012 at 10:55 pm

          yes, my bad. But you know they haven’t been SDS C in decades ‘-)

  • Warrior-15 December 4, 2012 at 10:15 am

    Congrats to Hartong and Uiato making all region AA honors!

    And Congrats to Shoji for region coach of the year honors!

  • Warrior-15 December 4, 2012 at 10:19 am

    Cindy wrote: “Someone had to input the info and you have to wonder how the original data was weighted.”

    The RPI — even with all its flaws and biases — is no secret. The formula is readily available out there on the intraweb, including how much weight is given to the 3 main components:

    25% to a team’s own win/loss percentage
    50% to opponents’ win/loss percentage
    25% to opponents’ opponents’ win/loss percentage

    (Also, there is no added weight given to “home” matches for volleyball. That added component is only used in college basketball.)

    • Orbitalripz December 4, 2012 at 2:17 pm

      As I have posted many times on this blog before, the NCAA men’s and women’s basketball committee have publicly stated that it no longer “tweaks” the final RPI (to account for unstated variables) that is released prior to the NCAA selections.

      What you see in NCAA RPI for basketball is what you get.

      Thus, as long as the programmer inputs the correct location — home, away, neutral (and many don’t know what to call the court when, for example, a team is playing in town but not on its home court, such as the Wahine playing @ NBC but not SSC) — the RPI can be duplicated.

      However, the NCAA volleyball committee has never stated publicly if it does or does not “tweak” the final RPI before the NCAA selections are announced. Thus I have yet to come across a private RPI that exactly duplicates the NCAA RPI, which should be very very easy to do given that they do not even take into account location (home, away, neutral). Just win or lose, that’s it. How simple can you get? Do the math (following the formula).

      Yet as I’ve pointed out before, strange things happen to that final RPI that is released to the public on the day of Selection Sunday.

      And I have yet to come across anyone on VT duplicating that Selection Sunday NCAA RPI.

      As every Computer Science 101 students knows, GIGO — Garbage In, Garbage Out. Sometimes, it isn’t what it is.

      • Cindy Luis December 4, 2012 at 6:58 pm

        True but the ncaa basketball tournament is seeded through all 66 teams and the regionals. not always at campus arenas, mostly at big city arenas.

    • volleyball fan December 4, 2012 at 2:40 pm

      This whole RPI formula sounds so complex. There must be a simpler and fairer formula to compute efficacy.

  • Fckalihi December 4, 2012 at 10:54 am

    Someone on VT wrote that the NCAA doesn’t select tournament sites in places that allow gambling on college games. Is that true?

    • hollycow December 4, 2012 at 12:23 pm

      That’s what I read somewhere in VT or this blog. It was said it’s stated in the NCAA manual so the LV idea is probably not considered.

      • dedicatedfan December 4, 2012 at 12:45 pm

        If I am not mistaken, the NCAA has held basketball tournaments there, but I could be wrong.

        • Cindy Luis December 4, 2012 at 7:23 pm

          conference tournaments have been held in Las Vegas but they will there’s something gambling that presents a problem.

    • Judge Judy December 4, 2012 at 12:49 pm

      Well hells bells if someone on volleytalk said it must be true,right ?

      • dedicatedfan December 4, 2012 at 12:51 pm

        Is that you. Cindy, impersonating, Judge Judy?

      • ProcecutorJoe December 4, 2012 at 1:59 pm

        he’s just saying, always a SA in the crowd.

        • Cindy Luis December 4, 2012 at 7:30 pm

          no idea what you’re talking about. haven’t been on VT. was at the dentist for 4 hours and then sleeping for another 4.

  • Haiku December 4, 2012 at 3:25 pm

    Why is it that the womens basketball can go on road trips to start the season and Uh womens volleyball cant?? UH wants revenue from home games but I think it would benefit them to schedule some tough competition on the mainland to prepare them for regionals and help the rpi. I think the comittee resents that UH gplays no out of conference road games. Also why does a team like kentucky play 30 games and Uh only 28???

    • roofer68 December 4, 2012 at 3:50 pm

      The RPI does not factor in home or away status of matches, nor how they won 3-0 3-1 or 3-2.
      That said, I’m for one am so happy to witness 3 four team tournaments with 9 top teams, that we Hawaii volley fans would not have a chance to watch in person. Thank you Chevron, Hawaiian Airlines and Verizon for continuing the tradition.

      • Haiku December 4, 2012 at 4:10 pm

        I love watching the home games too but I would gladly give up a few regular season home games for subregional home games.

        Also think UH should look into a home at home with a nat

        • Haiku December 4, 2012 at 4:12 pm

          Meant should look into a home and home series with a national power like penn state or nebraska, one year they come to the ssc and the next the wahine go play there etc.

          • roofer68 December 4, 2012 at 5:47 pm

            I understand what you’re saying about scheduling a top 10 team home and away in alternate years, but there are several issues with that in mind. Next season UH is playing in 20 conference and 9 pre-season tournament matches. If a team would come here between the conference schedule it would not make sense to schedule only one match. 2 matches in consecutive nights, like Notre Dame and Pepperdine would make more money sense, for taking a flight out here. So were’re looking at 31 matches in the regular season. I’m not aware of the maximum amount of matches UH is allowed to play in the season, but 28 matches is the maximum am’t that they have played in my recent memory.

          • roofer68 December 4, 2012 at 5:54 pm

            I see a small glitch there, the last sentence should read UH is allowed in the regular season, sans post-season play, the NCAA tournament.

          • roofer68 December 4, 2012 at 6:56 pm

            Just found out it’s 28 play dates, so the only way they can gain a play date is play 2 matches in one day, and that’s not going to happen in the 3 pre-season tournaments here. So with 20 days of Big West matches and 9 days of pre-season matches, that’s 29 play dates. I’m not clear of how UH is going to handle this situation to gain one play date to meet the criterior of 28 dates. Maybe they’ll get a special exemption and be given a extra date. Or maybe Cindy or someone on this blog can give their input.

  • bobbarker December 4, 2012 at 5:07 pm

    We live on an island in the middle of the Pacific. They don’t

  • GO BOWS! December 4, 2012 at 5:15 pm

    mita uiato and em hartong are ALL-Region

  • Immewhou December 4, 2012 at 5:25 pm

    Well getting time for some BW head coaching jobs to open up.

    UC Riverside Head Women’s Volleyball Coach Ron Larsen Announces Resignation http://bit.ly/TB8lok

    • warriorfan December 4, 2012 at 6:13 pm

      Can Riverside just go d2 instead ? They really hurt the big west rpi big time.

      • dedicatedfan December 4, 2012 at 8:17 pm

        Boise St. is the team that will really hurt the BWC, wish they had not voted them in.

  • Immewhou December 4, 2012 at 5:52 pm

    Is Mike Sealy just a flash in the pan ? Maybe he just got lucky last year ?

    • mauna December 4, 2012 at 6:03 pm

      Lucky maybe, women’s volleyball is such a momentum game, you can have the #1 ranked team and get beat by a way lower ranked team on a given night. Last year there was so much parity, UCLA had the right draw and won it all. Maybe if they were in USC slot in Hawaii’s regional they wouldn’t have made it to the final four, who know’s. The volleyball is round and bounces in some funny ways.

    • warriorfan December 4, 2012 at 6:14 pm

      NO, michigan state is just for real. That transfer Lauren Wicinski is real good, wish UH picked her up instead of Kastl. Although I like Ashley.

    • Cindy Luis December 4, 2012 at 7:00 pm

      no, why would you even think that? he’s a great coach. can’t win all the time.

      • hollycow December 4, 2012 at 7:49 pm

        Cindy, a question was brought up about play dates. If info is correct the NCAA allows 28 play dates for the regular season. UH has 9 for the pre-season tournaments and 20 for the Big West. Is there a plan to shore up one date, such as get an exemption because of the ocean, or play 19 matches in the Big West or have 3 teams for one of the 3 tournaments to cut back one play date? Info from Shoji would be much appreciated.

        • warriorfan December 4, 2012 at 8:07 pm

          a crazy idea just popped in my head.
          But I wonder if UH can play two conference games in one day? so they can schedule more out of conference matches to help rpi. Since they are only allowed 28 play days.

          • dedicatedfan December 4, 2012 at 8:15 pm

            One thing the BWC could do is, decide to play one team just once, instead of twice.

          • hollycow December 4, 2012 at 8:25 pm

            dedicatedfan that’s what I had in mind when I brought up playing 19 BW matches. A skipped trip to Idaho would be much appreciated by the girls, coaches and staff.

          • warriorfan December 4, 2012 at 8:29 pm

            If we can skip UC riverside, Boise State, Cal Poly and UC Irvine, that would be GREAT :)

          • Cindy Luis December 4, 2012 at 10:56 pm

            Not going to happen. Besides you don’t know what the RPI of those teams will be next year. UCI and Cal Poly pretty high just a few years ago

        • Cindy Luis December 4, 2012 at 10:51 pm

          Don’t know. was thinking the same thing. unless one tournament is only with 2 tother teams. Don’t see them doing a triple header like they do at some schools where they’d play 2 matches same day.

  • tenzil December 4, 2012 at 7:57 pm

    Mike Sealy is a very good coach & recruiter. Found the defensive methodology he drilled into his players very sound. Yes, the game has a lot of momentum. But look at the ‘lucky’ coaches who’ve won it all over the last 10 years, and ask if the others were just unlucky.

  • ALLAN December 5, 2012 at 4:50 am


    • hollycow December 5, 2012 at 12:42 pm

      Cindy, any update on Shoji and the NCAA rep?

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